Guitar and Bass help

Hi there everybody...I've been recording for about a year now and I think I do pretty good but one weakness I have is always getting a good Bass Guitar sound in the mix. I've tried carving frequency wholes to some success but wondered if any of you could lend me some tips. Also I record my own band's songs and I am the only guitarist we have. I record take one (panned hard left) with a Sennheiser e609 silver on-center about 2-3 inches from the grill and a behringer b2 condenser mic placed off-center about 6-8 inches from the grill to capture a bit of natural reverb. The two mics go to two individual tracks to be comped together later. Now usually I'll repeat the process for take two (panned hard right) but use a different guitar and a different amp...I just wanted to know your thoughts on whether or not the off-center fill mics (behringer)should be directly mixed in with the e609 tracks and panned hard also or if they should be left individually and panned more like 40-60% left or right to add a bit of center fill and ambience for the guitar tracks? I have never done so but I was wondering if anyone could give me a few tips or tell me maybe something that works for them. I know you are probably gonna say to experiment but I just need some criticism or advice. Thanks for everyone reading this and lending their support! - RAiN -

try this same post on recording.org. Much more helpful for engineering questions. This is still a great forum though...

Rain, Uou are not off par at all man. I tend to take the 609 and a SM57 though. Usually what I have been doing to get a thicker sound is do doubled guitars for each guitarist. if it is only you, try to record once, then play it again and then do your pans. You will find that it will make the guitars sound HUGE if done correctly and you do not have to pan hard 100 and -100. That is for your ears to decide. I think hat the 609 is a great mic. Never used the Ber. mic, but I am sure that it is a clone of a 57 type? Get yourself a 57 and compare. Standard cab mic really ya know. You can also try to submix ( or buss) the guitars to a stereo aux track as well. I do that a lot and compress and eq just that track. Also, EQ the guitars, then slap the RComp on it and squash them. Or even the LA2A if you have it. I think that by playing the guitar track twice you will hear it fatten up a lot! Good luck and I hope that this helps? - Doc

I have used SM57's in the past and have leaned more towards the 609's now. I used the Behringer B2 Condenser's to capture a wider range. I will try the DI thing next time and see how it goes...I have also heard about this technique - I have heard of mic'ing a cab the way I normally do but splitting the signal of two mics into four channels, so you have 2 originals and 2 copies. I read somewhere or heard somewhere that if you pan the originals one way and the copies the other all you have to do is simply move the entire audio track 16ms-32ms (or delaying the originals and bussing them somewhere) forward in time and it you wont have phasing and that this small increment is so small our ears cannot perceive the difference. Has anyone tried this? Thanks again.

I' too lik ethe 57/609 combo, or a 609 and NTK combo. Try moving the ambient mic further away, using the 3:1 rule. (Two mics capturing the same source the further mic sould be 3x the distance minimum from the source as the close mic to prevent phase issues.)

I often use a duplicate track which is delayed a bit (1600 samples is my starting point). Its not as good as real doubletracking, but works well if you're in a hurry. Also try different EQ on the dupe track. Sometimes I will run the duplicate track thru a verb plugin at 100% wet and only bring it up enought to creat a sense of space.

take a miked track and a DI'd track and buss them together. the combination should give nice results. and remember to check phases. peaks of the two tracks should be exactly same place, so nudge if needed. if you need to fix dynamics, i'd suggest you try the bf1776. you can place it on the combined mix or either miked or DI'd track. experiment.

As far as bass recording goes.....I normally use a miked amp (md421) /DI combo compressed with a dbx 160x @ 6:1. However, I've gotten some great results running the bass into a POD then straight into the Digi.